Whistleblowing, Writing & Activism Featuring Danielle Spencer

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Welcome. I'm Eric Fleming, host of A Moment with Eric Fleming, the podcast of our time.

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listen to it. That will help the podcast tremendously.

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The following program is hosted by the NVG Podcast Network.

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Music.

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Hello, and welcome to another moment with Eric Fleming. I am your host, Eric Fleming.

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And first of all, welcome to another year.

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And it's already starting off bad.

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So, you know, we kind of was hoping And, you know, it's still early But the

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way that the year started off is not good at all,

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And I'm going to address one of the things that happened,

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I also want to acknowledge the fact It was mentioned last week in the news that,

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President Jimmy Carter died.

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And he was the first presidential campaign I followed.

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As a young man, I guess I was about 11. He was, you know, that was the first

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convention I watched and he was really the first presidential campaign that

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he really paid attention to.

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I mean, I knew presidents, but not the campaigns. And so 1976 was a very,

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very interesting year. Of course, it was a bicentennial year, too.

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So I always have had a special respect for President Carter,

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and especially after he lost to Reagan,

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all the work that he did just as a citizen merits special recognition.

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And I had a privilege to go to the Carter Center and to read some of the stuff

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and see the awards and his life journey and all that.

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He lived a great hundred years and I wish to everybody is that,

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that you live that long and that you have that much of an impact on the world that you live in.

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So we lost a good one, along with several others last year.

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But President Carter, considering the nature of this show,

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was a major influence and a major impact on how I think, how I tried to govern,

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and how I want to live the remainder of my days.

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All right. Now that I've said all that. Well, one other thing I want to add.

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He he showed what inclusion look like.

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You know, Lyndon Johnson kind of got it going.

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As far as in his cabinet and appointments, but Carter took it to the next level

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and really opened the door for where we are now, where Democrats and Republicans,

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are trying to find competent African-Americans to serve, and some not so competent,

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but we won't get into that.

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So thank you, President Carter, and we're going to miss you.

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So now that I've said all that, it's time to go ahead and get this started.

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I do have a guest, and she has a very, very compelling story to tell.

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She's been very prolific in that she's written three books and has become an

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activist based off of a challenge that she's had to deal with.

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So, I hope that you will enjoy hearing her story and be inspired by it as well.

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Other than that, Grace is back.

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I'm glad she's doing well. And so, that's my cue to say it is time for a moment of news for Grace G.

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Music.

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A U.S. Army veteran crashed a pickup truck into a crowd in New Orleans' French

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Quarter on New Year's Day, killing 15 and injuring about 30,

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before dying in a shootout with police.

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Later that day, a Tesla Cybertruck exploded outside the Trump International

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Hotel in Las Vegas, resulting in one death and seven injuries.

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Puerto Rico experienced a widespread power outage on New Year's Eve,

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affecting 87% of customers.

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Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen warned that the U.S.

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May need to implement extraordinary measures by January 14th to avoid defaulting on its debt.

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President-elect Donald Trump has requested the U.S. Supreme Court to delay a

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law that could ban TikTok or force its sale.

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New York Governor Kathy Hochul initiated prison reforms and began firing officers

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involved in the beating death of inmate Robert Brooks, whose violent encounter

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was recorded and is under investigation.

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A federal appeals court upheld E. Jean Carroll's $5 million verdict against

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Donald Trump for sexual abuse and defamation.

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Russian President Putin issued a rare apology to Azerbaijan's leader regarding

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an Azerbaijan Airlines plane crash,

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which was reportedly shot down by Russian air defenses amid Ukrainian drone

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attacks, resulting in at least 38 fatalities. The U.S.

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Government fund compensating victims of Bernard Madoff announced its final distribution,

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totaling $4.3 billion to 40,930 claimants A HUD report revealed over 770,000

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individuals experienced homelessness on a single night in January 2024,

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marking an 18% increase from the previous year And a state funeral for former

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President Jimmy Carter will be held on January 9th at the Washington National Cathedral.

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I am Grace Gee, and this has been A Moment of News.

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Music.

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All right. Thank you, Grace, for that moment of news. And again,

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I'm really glad that you're back.

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So now it's time for my first guest.

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And her name is Danielle Spencer.

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Danielle Spencer is a senior leader of almost 25 years of experience focused

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on business, finance and acquisition management.

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She is a change agent transforming and improving business operations and processes.

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She has two master's degrees, one in business administration and the other in

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information systems, and a bachelor's degree in medical and research technology.

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She is also certified in information assurance, cybersecurity,

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and project management.

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She is also the author of three books.

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And we're going to talk about the subject matter of those three books and what

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was the inspiration behind those three books.

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So, ladies and gentlemen, it is my distinct honor and privilege to have as a

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guest on this podcast, Danielle Spencer.

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Music.

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All right. Danielle Spencer, how you doing, ma'am? Happy New Year. Good to see you.

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Happy New Year. I'm doing great. Thank you for the opportunity to be on your platform.

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Well, thank you for accepting the invitation, because one of the things that

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I haven't talked about on this show is whistleblowing.

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And although, you know, it gets like this headline treatment and all that stuff,

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as somebody that's a former elected

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official, I think whistleblowing is an important part of public policy.

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And because I think people need to be held accountable that serve in government.

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And so when I came across your profile and saw that you had that,

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you had been through that, you've been a whistleblower and you documented it

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in like two incredible stories and a third book,

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kind of a, I guess, a self-help guide.

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If somebody is concerned about their data and their their personal information,

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I figured, yeah, this would be this would be a really, really good conversation.

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So what I like to do at the beginning is to break the ice and I throw a quote.

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Now, I'm doing something a little different because I usually don't tell people

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where the quote came from, but I think it's important in the context.

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So Thomas Jefferson was trying to get the University of Virginia paid for by

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the state legislature at the time.

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And so he had written a couple of letters. He had written some letters to all

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the different leaders in the legislature, whatever. But the first letter he

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wrote, he ended with these words.

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It says, the important truths, that knowledge is power, that knowledge is safety,

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and that knowledge is happiness.

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What does that quote mean to you? I wouldn't say that that is a very timely

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quote that kind of fits in with what I'm trying to do with the books and talking with people.

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I don't think, I would say most of us, understand how important knowledge is.

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And when you lack it or you don't have it, how easily you can be manipulated or taken advantage of.

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So for me, that quote kind of speaks and even like kind of what we're going

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through now as a country and even in some parts, other parts of the world,

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how there's a lack of knowledge.

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And that because of that lack of knowledge, people are being taken advantage

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of, people being mistreated because they don't have that lack of knowledge.

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And that once you get it, it brings freedom, it brings empowerment to you or to a group of people.

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So outside of probably being mistaken for the girl from what's happening now,

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what was your life like prior to 2016 in a nutshell?

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What, what, how was, how was your life?

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I mean, were you achieving your goals? Did you have the job that you want?

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What, what, what was going on prior to 2016?

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I would say it had a very, now to me.

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I would suggest uneventful to others, they would say, kind of boring.

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But I grew up in a middle-class family. My parents, they weren't college graduates,

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but they had good jobs, almost a blue-collar jobs.

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I am the first person in my family, on both sides, both my parents,

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to be a college graduate. it.

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So we were, or say I was very taught like our history about civil rights,

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about women's rights. I had a very good foundation.

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So before 2016, you know, had a good job, nothing, I won't say it was perfect

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because there's no such thing as perfect, but a pretty uneventful life.

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Understood kind of what our people had been through, what we had to fight to,

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you know, get our rights.

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And I just thought things were moving smoothly. And then 2016, 2017 happened.

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All right. So let's get into that. What exactly happened in that time frame

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in 2016 and 2017 that changed your life?

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I became a whistleblower against a, I'll say a Caucasian male in the federal government.

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And to me, what I blew the whistle on was very, very boring.

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It was nothing salacious.

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It wasn't, to me, anything that would even garner people's attention.

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I, based on my knowledge and experience, had interpretation of acquisition law

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that differed from what this individual did.

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And I told them, you know, if that's how you want to interpret it,

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that's fine, But I won't be a part of it because if something happens, if you violate like a.

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The appropriations law or any

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other thing happened, when Congress starts knocking, I'm not answering.

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You'll have to answer all those questions, but I won't.

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And me having that type of stance set off this avalanche of what I believe was

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retaliation to something like I thought was very simple.

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Because if he wanted to move forward with bringing people on that hadn't been

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cleared or violating appropriations law, he could have done it because he was my supervisor.

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He didn't need my approval or my, he didn't need my acquiesce for me to agree

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to what he was doing to do it.

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But it was almost an anger that I had the nerve to speak up against the direction

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that He wanted to go and not just him. That was people above him.

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And what I believe is this had kind of led to we are going to destroy her and

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anybody associated with her at all costs.

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Because you had because I had the nerve to say I'm not going to be involved in that.

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So you kind of felt.

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You kind of felt when you saw what was going on, you just kind of felt,

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hey, look, I need to say something.

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You know, if they do something about it, so be it if they don't.

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Oh, well, at least I just highlighted what was going on. Was that kind of your

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mindset at that particular point?

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Well, at first, I will say it started where he would just use an example.

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There was a contractor had not cleared the security process and wanted to bring

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them on and have them ask that. I'm not doing that.

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I'm not approving invoices. I'm not doing that. And I told him directly.

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He would get upset and then would complain. And then that's kind of how it,

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for the most part, escalated.

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Complain and then why won't you do? Because policy says X, Y, and Z.

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And because this policy says that and it's written and every year I have to

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take this training to saying that I understand what the policy is and I agree to abide by it,

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I can't then violate that policy. I'll be held liable for that.

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So that's kind of how it started. It would, you know, a request to do something.

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And I'm like, no, I'm not doing that.

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And I would tell him directly, I wouldn't go behind his back.

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And I said, no, I'm not doing that.

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And then there would be an insistence. And I'm saying, I'm not doing it.

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Give them written, you know, explanation as to why. And that's kind of how it

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started. And it went that went through through 2017 until I left.

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And I would say late in 2017, the retaliation became, you know,

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I want to say really started.

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It got, you know, I say my incident in my mind got worse after I left the that

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federal government agency.

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So now you you've ended up writing two books based on the experience. Well, really three.

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But the two books that kind of chronicle what you did is called Digital Assassins,

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Digital Assassins and then Digital Assassins, too.

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What made you decide to write about that experience?

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And why did you decide to do it in a fictional way?

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I've had another guest who went through, it wasn't a whistleblower situation.

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She went through just racial discrimination at the job, but she decided to tell

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her story, but use fictional characters.

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What was your motivation to, first of all, to write a book or two books about

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it and then to do it in a fictional way?

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The motivation for the book started in 2022.

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That's when I want to say events and documentation started to be fabricated.

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And I won't ever say that I was fearful, but when those events started to occur,

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I became very concerned.

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And it didn't just involve me, it involved family members.

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So one example from the book was when my parents got a ticket,

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they were accused of not stopping for a school bus.

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And when we got the ticket in the mail, I saw it and everything,

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and it was a completely fabricated event.

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And when you look at the documents that we got in the mail, it was as if someone

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had been following my father to get a picture of the back of his van.

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But what people didn't realize at the time, the exact same time that they were

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supposedly not stopping for the school bus, they were at a doctor's appointment.

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And it wasn't just like my mom was at a doctor's appointment or my father.

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They both were at the same doctor at the same time. And so, you know,

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I fought, you know, did the write-up to fight the ticket, and it quickly disappeared.

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No one could explain to us how this would happen, but it just disappeared,

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and no one wanted to talk about it anymore.

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But it was several events like that that happened, and it started in 2022,

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that made me become concerned that, you know, when you start fabricating events,

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start fabricating documents, what else can happen?

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And so I said, I'm going to have to start documenting this in a book and kind

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of put it out there, kind of this is what happened.

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So that was what motivated me to do the books and kind of document it.

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When I tried to find a publisher and looking for a literary agent,

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which I will say a lot of people were scared.

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They were like, we're not going to touch this. I did have a self-publishing

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agent who spoke with me kind of like off the record and said,

00:21:18.820 --> 00:21:20.920
because of your subject matter.

00:21:22.250 --> 00:21:26.170
Would recommend that you do it as a fiction. He said, not a nonfiction.

00:21:26.730 --> 00:21:32.010
Because if you get one word or one sentence wrong in a conversation,

00:21:32.530 --> 00:21:38.210
you could open yourself up to possible legal ramifications because someone could

00:21:38.210 --> 00:21:40.150
say, well, they were misquoted.

00:21:40.650 --> 00:21:43.990
He said, even though you didn't want to use people's real names,

00:21:44.530 --> 00:21:52.290
just to protect myself to do it as a fiction, a fiction book based off true events.

00:21:52.590 --> 00:21:57.430
So that's, I'll say, kind of why it's fiction book as opposed to nonfiction.

00:21:58.150 --> 00:22:05.590
So, you know, reading it, it's like if you went through all of the stuff.

00:22:06.670 --> 00:22:10.810
That's in the book, and then you just mentioned something about your parents,

00:22:10.970 --> 00:22:15.630
so So had you been dealing with challenges,

00:22:16.270 --> 00:22:23.030
retaliation, and all that stuff up until 2022, from the time that you first

00:22:23.030 --> 00:22:24.110
became a whistleblower?

00:22:24.370 --> 00:22:31.670
It started in 2017, and I will say it's still ongoing now, so it hasn't stopped.

00:22:31.930 --> 00:22:38.130
To me, it's escalated. I would say when it started in 2017, 2018,

00:22:38.730 --> 00:22:41.610
there were things, I would say more administrative.

00:22:42.110 --> 00:22:44.790
I don't want to say they weren't serious because they were serious,

00:22:44.850 --> 00:22:49.330
but it would be something such as interfering in job opportunities.

00:22:50.130 --> 00:22:56.170
I was offered a job with another federal government agency and the individual

00:22:56.170 --> 00:23:02.330
with whom I was having challenges with, he contacted that other agency and forced

00:23:02.330 --> 00:23:04.710
them to rescind the job offer.

00:23:04.890 --> 00:23:09.330
And I have all this like stuff in writing. So it started off with things like

00:23:09.330 --> 00:23:16.850
that in 2022 is when to me, things got really off the hook where I said,

00:23:17.130 --> 00:23:19.910
documents and situations were starting to be fabricated.

00:23:20.030 --> 00:23:23.010
And so, and it hasn't stopped, but.

00:23:24.329 --> 00:23:33.309
Now, say it's more using electronic or digital methods and digital mediums to do the retaliation.

00:23:33.969 --> 00:23:39.129
So what what kind of impact does that have on you?

00:23:39.449 --> 00:23:45.969
What kind of impact would you think that would have on other people that something you did?

00:23:46.569 --> 00:23:51.189
God, that's so that's basically equivalent to the time that I've been in Atlanta.

00:23:51.189 --> 00:23:56.829
I got to Atlanta in 2017, and I've been married, divorced, all that stuff since then.

00:23:57.009 --> 00:23:59.109
So a lot of stuff has happened to me.

00:23:59.429 --> 00:24:06.629
I'm just imagining what impact has that been on your life for all those years

00:24:06.629 --> 00:24:19.269
for somebody or some entity to continue to harass you or continue to put roadblocks, I guess,

00:24:19.449 --> 00:24:21.609
is a safe word in your life?

00:24:22.709 --> 00:24:26.709
It's because of the kind of makeup that I have.

00:24:27.149 --> 00:24:33.309
For the most part, I don't get fearful, but I will get upset.

00:24:33.829 --> 00:24:35.469
And I have an attitude.

00:24:36.109 --> 00:24:40.149
I want to say, yeah, okay, well, you got the right one this time. I'm a fighter.

00:24:40.889 --> 00:24:44.369
So it kind of more motivated me to fight.

00:24:45.089 --> 00:24:51.149
What I would say within the last two to three years, what I did know this night,

00:24:51.369 --> 00:24:56.969
it took me a doctor kind of telling me I was starting to have physical ailments

00:24:56.969 --> 00:24:59.749
where I didn't think it was impacting me.

00:25:00.009 --> 00:25:04.949
But a doctor let me know that when you're under this type of stress all the

00:25:04.949 --> 00:25:08.009
time and they had to explain it to me.

00:25:08.009 --> 00:25:17.989
It was like, no matter what you do, someone is looking for an opportunity to set you up. And if.

00:25:19.189 --> 00:25:23.069
I'm not giving them the opportunity, like being someone who runs out or goes

00:25:23.069 --> 00:25:27.629
out at night to a party and drinks and then have a cop stop you,

00:25:27.629 --> 00:25:32.269
you know, out of the blue and to give you tickets because I don't have any of

00:25:32.269 --> 00:25:33.489
those type of scenarios.

00:25:34.189 --> 00:25:37.849
So then situations have to be fabricated.

00:25:38.309 --> 00:25:43.189
And so what it kind of puts you in a mindset of always looking over your shoulder.

00:25:44.389 --> 00:25:51.269
And again, like I said, because of my makeup and because I'm a STEM student, I studied medicine.

00:25:51.309 --> 00:25:53.589
I had dreams of becoming a doctor.

00:25:53.829 --> 00:25:58.489
And so most of the people who kind of come from that background were very detail-oriented,

00:25:58.669 --> 00:25:59.729
very process-oriented.

00:25:59.989 --> 00:26:06.169
So there were a lot of things that I want to say that I learned from childhood

00:26:06.169 --> 00:26:09.629
and from college that are just habits now.

00:26:10.349 --> 00:26:17.169
So whereas I think it might have had a lot more effect on someone else, it hasn't been that.

00:26:17.229 --> 00:26:24.109
And it has been somewhat impactful, but not as much as it would be someone else, if that makes sense.

00:26:24.769 --> 00:26:29.029
It's something I don't like it, but I'm a fighter.

00:26:29.469 --> 00:26:34.309
And because I am very detail-oriented, I document just about everything.

00:26:35.129 --> 00:26:39.549
It's hard to kind of get me caught up. Thank God for that. But it's kind of

00:26:39.549 --> 00:26:41.089
hard to get me caught up in stuff.

00:26:41.249 --> 00:26:43.489
So I think it's probably more frustrating

00:26:43.489 --> 00:26:48.509
for the other, for whoever these people are, than it is for me.

00:26:51.149 --> 00:26:55.949
So that's a segue into this question. In Paul's second letter to Timothy,

00:26:56.189 --> 00:27:00.669
the first chapter and seven verse, it reads, For God has not given us a spirit

00:27:00.669 --> 00:27:03.969
of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.

00:27:03.969 --> 00:27:11.969
How has that Bible verse guided your life journey other than your training in

00:27:11.969 --> 00:27:16.549
STEM and staying disciplined and detail-oriented and all that?

00:27:16.749 --> 00:27:21.089
How did that Bible verse help you? It's amazing.

00:27:21.926 --> 00:27:29.246
For this instance, or for what I'm going through now, I know the verse and I understand it.

00:27:29.426 --> 00:27:37.206
But I want to say, for me, this is probably one of the first real situations

00:27:37.206 --> 00:27:39.146
I've dealt with, if that makes sense.

00:27:39.386 --> 00:27:45.826
Like I said, even being a Black woman in America, my ancestors,

00:27:45.986 --> 00:27:49.186
the people that came before me, they fought all those fights.

00:27:49.186 --> 00:27:56.666
So I had been enjoying the benefits of what other people had kind of sacrificed.

00:27:57.346 --> 00:28:03.986
So now this is like the first time, not that I haven't experienced racism.

00:28:04.306 --> 00:28:08.266
I think me personally, I've experienced more sexism than I have racism.

00:28:08.266 --> 00:28:16.906
But this is kind of the first time where I'm like coming against someone and or something.

00:28:17.746 --> 00:28:21.986
And we're also you really have to put your faith into action where.

00:28:23.106 --> 00:28:28.646
Well, God, you're going to have to protect me because I can't fight the federal government.

00:28:28.866 --> 00:28:35.586
I can't do that. And so while I understand that, that verse,

00:28:35.886 --> 00:28:41.606
mine is more so with kind of having peace and.

00:28:42.730 --> 00:28:48.970
About the situation and not being, I want to say, vengeful or angry and not

00:28:48.970 --> 00:28:53.430
letting anger kind of take over and getting where I'm angry,

00:28:53.530 --> 00:28:56.030
almost kind of hateful people.

00:28:56.530 --> 00:28:59.610
And I want to say, for me, it's a good thing.

00:28:59.670 --> 00:29:03.130
I don't know who the people are because I think that'd be harder to do if you

00:29:03.130 --> 00:29:05.170
really knew who the individuals were.

00:29:06.290 --> 00:29:12.030
But I'm not necessarily fearful. It's more so I get angry, especially when,

00:29:12.270 --> 00:29:17.370
like I said, the people in my family, my parents, you know, they're senior citizens.

00:29:17.930 --> 00:29:26.610
It's not a pleasant feeling seeing other people be mistreated because someone is upset with you.

00:29:27.250 --> 00:29:32.870
So I would say that's more of anger and being upset is more something I have

00:29:32.870 --> 00:29:35.750
to really deal with other than fear.

00:29:36.350 --> 00:29:41.630
I got you. It sounds more like Second Chronicles. It's like the battle is not yours. It's the Lord's.

00:29:41.690 --> 00:29:46.270
You're going to let, you know, just give me some peace and you handle it.

00:29:46.790 --> 00:29:55.330
Let me see. What did I want to? Oh, so what's the most important thing one must

00:29:55.330 --> 00:29:58.950
do to protect themselves from this kind of stuff?

00:29:59.070 --> 00:30:02.330
And like you said, you talked about being detail oriented and all that.

00:30:02.330 --> 00:30:08.410
But what's the most important thing you must do to protect yourself if for anybody

00:30:08.410 --> 00:30:16.410
else that is listening, it's like they're dealing with a situation and or, you know,

00:30:16.510 --> 00:30:21.450
they're just happy-go-lucky folks that like to shop a lot on Christmas and on Amazon.

00:30:21.970 --> 00:30:25.450
What's the most important things somebody needs to do to protect themselves?

00:30:26.290 --> 00:30:30.290
The first thing I would say, and going back to your quote, is knowledge.

00:30:31.290 --> 00:30:38.230
That we have to have an understanding of what our rights are, have an understanding.

00:30:38.370 --> 00:30:43.590
You don't have to be a tech genius, but have an understanding of technology

00:30:43.590 --> 00:30:48.690
and where we are now and where things are going to go in the future.

00:30:49.370 --> 00:30:54.290
And not be fearful of that. I've had conversations with people and they're like,

00:30:54.390 --> 00:30:56.550
oh, my God, AI. I understand.

00:30:57.130 --> 00:31:04.130
Have your moment where you like, oh, my. Then calm down and get knowledge about the situation.

00:31:04.450 --> 00:31:07.310
So the first thing I would tell people is to have knowledge,

00:31:07.470 --> 00:31:14.510
knowledge of what laws are, technology, and what policies are,

00:31:14.570 --> 00:31:15.710
especially where you work.

00:31:15.710 --> 00:31:22.890
The second is to document when situations do not feel right to you.

00:31:23.690 --> 00:31:28.570
Everybody, you have that feeling when something is not right.

00:31:29.858 --> 00:31:34.078
Someone on your job asks you to do something and it doesn't feel quite right

00:31:34.078 --> 00:31:38.438
to you, or you get this phone call and people are asking you for your information

00:31:38.438 --> 00:31:40.038
that doesn't quite feel right for you.

00:31:40.918 --> 00:31:46.378
Listen to that feeling. You don't have to be rude and obnoxious to the individual,

00:31:46.898 --> 00:31:51.678
but there's something in that request that's not sitting right with your spirit

00:31:51.678 --> 00:31:55.978
and you need to listen to it, document it, ask questions.

00:31:56.978 --> 00:32:00.358
And, you know, when I have talks with people, I tell them, like I said,

00:32:00.478 --> 00:32:03.238
you can do it in a non-threatening, a non-rude way.

00:32:03.958 --> 00:32:08.078
On your job, if you're asked to do something and you don't feel comfortable

00:32:08.078 --> 00:32:10.738
about it, you can always circle back.

00:32:10.898 --> 00:32:14.478
And the way that you document it isn't a follow-up email.

00:32:14.838 --> 00:32:18.518
You know, you want to follow up on the early request. You want to make sure

00:32:18.518 --> 00:32:19.818
you understood it correctly.

00:32:20.138 --> 00:32:26.118
If you have some concerns, bring it up in the email. So those are kind of things that you can do.

00:32:26.578 --> 00:32:33.758
And one of the other things that I think is important, and I didn't quite understand

00:32:33.758 --> 00:32:37.918
it until I had the situation, is really supporting.

00:32:37.918 --> 00:32:43.878
There are a lot of organizations out there, whistleblower, social justice, privacy.

00:32:44.278 --> 00:32:48.138
There are organizations that are already out there who are trying to fight these

00:32:48.138 --> 00:32:55.898
fights for us, keeping up to date with laws and political actions or political activity.

00:32:56.298 --> 00:33:01.938
Support those organizations, support those individuals, because as,

00:33:02.118 --> 00:33:07.418
especially from a digital perspective, of as things mature, we're really going

00:33:07.418 --> 00:33:13.138
to need those people to fight those battles for us so that when machines are

00:33:13.138 --> 00:33:14.858
coming on and they're trying to do everything,

00:33:15.298 --> 00:33:22.298
that there's some type of governance and law in place to be able to hold them accountable.

00:33:22.558 --> 00:33:28.618
So those are things I would say can do to kind of protect ourselves. Yeah.

00:33:29.738 --> 00:33:34.398
In your latest book, Protecting Yourself, How Data Theft Can Impact You.

00:33:34.798 --> 00:33:40.238
You stated that advocating for legislative changes was the one item that has

00:33:40.238 --> 00:33:43.778
proven to be the hardest obstacle to overcome.

00:33:44.458 --> 00:33:48.438
How do you plan to overcome it yourself?

00:33:48.438 --> 00:33:56.018
I mean, what are you doing to try to get laws changed and, I guess,

00:33:56.158 --> 00:34:07.178
fill in the gaps in policy and in a legal sense to protect people like yourself

00:34:07.178 --> 00:34:10.478
that want to hold people accountable, that whistleblower?

00:34:11.754 --> 00:34:17.794
That the election is over, I'm hopeful that I'll have a better audience,

00:34:18.074 --> 00:34:22.554
both at the state level and at the federal level.

00:34:23.514 --> 00:34:28.874
I've been trying to get some type of legislative action for almost two years.

00:34:29.194 --> 00:34:34.774
And I want to say, because I'm here in the Maryland, DMV in the Maryland,

00:34:35.034 --> 00:34:39.794
state of Maryland, You know, one of the representatives was accused of stealing.

00:34:39.794 --> 00:34:45.294
So I'm like, so he probably wasn't paying attention to my email or emails anyway.

00:34:46.354 --> 00:34:49.374
Then due to the election, I

00:34:49.374 --> 00:34:53.094
think people were, oh, we're not going to pay attention to that right now.

00:34:53.094 --> 00:35:00.514
So now that 2025, we have the elections are over with, I'm planning to start

00:35:00.514 --> 00:35:07.094
up again, emailing different representatives and seeing if I can get an audience with them.

00:35:07.354 --> 00:35:12.994
Also, one of my goals for this year is to get more involved in social activist

00:35:12.994 --> 00:35:19.434
organizations, not just donating money, but actually getting in with my time.

00:35:19.434 --> 00:35:26.374
And I'm hopeful that getting in with my time, I will be able to not only support

00:35:26.374 --> 00:35:30.154
what they're doing, but say, hey, this is something that I experienced.

00:35:30.514 --> 00:35:34.694
Do you think we can work together to see if we can bring about some legislative

00:35:34.694 --> 00:35:38.374
changes? That's going to help everybody, not just me.

00:35:38.554 --> 00:35:42.194
But this is something that I think is needed for our society, period.

00:35:42.474 --> 00:35:48.394
So that's what I'm hopeful that 2025 will be different. So what's the most important

00:35:48.394 --> 00:35:51.774
legislative change or policy change that needs to happen?

00:35:52.094 --> 00:35:57.154
What what is OK? You see this get through the Maryland Assembly.

00:35:57.454 --> 00:36:02.274
You see this gets through Congress. What what's the most important thing that needs to happen?

00:36:03.054 --> 00:36:10.434
Right now, there are some laws concerning our data, but there needs to be a

00:36:10.434 --> 00:36:15.114
little bit more, I want to say not a little, but a lot of more transparency about,

00:36:15.474 --> 00:36:21.934
I want to say from a state level, any organization that does business in your state.

00:36:21.934 --> 00:36:30.714
When they have a data breach or where people's data have been compromised or

00:36:30.714 --> 00:36:32.754
viewed and it shouldn't be,

00:36:33.654 --> 00:36:38.734
where people are notified and that there are a little bit more repercussions.

00:36:39.214 --> 00:36:41.034
From a federal level.

00:36:42.849 --> 00:36:47.209
It's going to, to me, be the hardest. There needs to be more governance around our data.

00:36:47.929 --> 00:36:53.749
Right now, from my experience, people can give any type of excuse they want

00:36:53.749 --> 00:36:58.169
and be able to get yours, mine, or somebody else's data.

00:36:58.489 --> 00:37:00.669
And it doesn't even have to be a valid excuse.

00:37:01.109 --> 00:37:06.169
And for me, that is very concerning because your data is very,

00:37:06.509 --> 00:37:08.569
people don't understand how valuable

00:37:08.569 --> 00:37:15.829
your information is. and it can be misused for any type of reason.

00:37:16.169 --> 00:37:22.329
And so there needs to be a lot more guardrails around when people's data is accessed.

00:37:22.689 --> 00:37:29.669
And if a person requests your data and they don't have a valid reason for doing

00:37:29.669 --> 00:37:33.169
it, there has to be some repercussions to that individual.

00:37:34.209 --> 00:37:38.789
Yeah. So basically what you're trying to do is make sure that laws are in place

00:37:38.789 --> 00:37:43.849
to minimize the weaponization of data breaches.

00:37:44.669 --> 00:37:49.209
Yes. And not just data breaches, but especially at the federal level.

00:37:50.169 --> 00:37:53.749
People just getting your data and and they don't have a reason why.

00:37:54.069 --> 00:37:57.809
And like I said, for me, I believe mine was whistleblower retaliation.

00:37:57.809 --> 00:38:03.009
But for someone else, let's say they're in a domestic situation,

00:38:03.009 --> 00:38:05.529
if the person works for federal government,

00:38:05.889 --> 00:38:14.089
they can get your data and say either you're looking for a job or it's a national security, whatever.

00:38:14.429 --> 00:38:19.989
They can give some type of reason. And right now, it seems, based on my experience,

00:38:20.389 --> 00:38:20.809
there are no repercussions.

00:38:21.969 --> 00:38:25.669
And I would say it's not me assuming this. No, I lived through it.

00:38:26.229 --> 00:38:31.489
The IRS asked for my data saying that they were looking at trying to vet me

00:38:31.489 --> 00:38:33.969
for a job and I hadn't applied there.

00:38:34.489 --> 00:38:38.329
And when I brought it up that I never applied for, you know,

00:38:38.409 --> 00:38:42.929
since I left, I didn't apply for a job there. I hadn't been interviewed.

00:38:43.789 --> 00:38:48.789
People, okay, well, no matter, you're still living.

00:38:49.349 --> 00:38:53.989
So we're not going to investigate this. I said, no, that's a problem because

00:38:53.989 --> 00:38:59.549
that person or whoever these people are basically have a book in my life from

00:38:59.549 --> 00:39:03.229
my driver's license number, social security, and not just mine,

00:39:03.609 --> 00:39:06.809
anybody associated with me. I said, that's a problem.

00:39:07.449 --> 00:39:15.349
And right now, the laws and the courts are like, well, unless they destroy you,

00:39:15.589 --> 00:39:18.289
we don't even want to be bothered with it.

00:39:18.409 --> 00:39:22.489
So to me, that's a problem that needs to be addressed.

00:39:23.049 --> 00:39:28.749
So you've written three books and now you're doing interviews and speaking engagements.

00:39:29.049 --> 00:39:34.169
What do you hope happens with this path of advocacy that you've taken?

00:39:36.385 --> 00:39:43.465
It's, I'm going to say, two things, like education awareness for citizens to

00:39:43.465 --> 00:39:49.805
kind of have understanding and knowledge of how technology can be misused and

00:39:49.805 --> 00:39:53.125
how your data can be weaponized. So that's one thing.

00:39:53.345 --> 00:40:00.085
The other is looking for, like I said, the legislative changes and not just for data.

00:40:00.085 --> 00:40:07.805
One of the examples that I give in the book is about my deeds that over 30 years

00:40:07.805 --> 00:40:10.905
old, where people can come back and say, hey,

00:40:11.525 --> 00:40:18.105
no, you do have this deed and we owe, we want money for this deed or maintenance deeds or whatever.

00:40:18.105 --> 00:40:24.125
And because everything is electronic now, people really understanding that electronic

00:40:24.125 --> 00:40:29.865
records can be manipulated and that most of us do not keep records for 20,

00:40:30.005 --> 00:40:31.445
30 years like paper records.

00:40:31.565 --> 00:40:37.745
Most of us don't. And that laws need to be updated to kind of reflect a new reality.

00:40:37.745 --> 00:40:42.565
And then I'm going to say the third part is from the corporation standpoint.

00:40:43.265 --> 00:40:49.165
Where having corporations, I don't want to say care, but have a little bit more

00:40:49.165 --> 00:40:53.685
stake in protecting people's data.

00:40:53.685 --> 00:40:59.785
If you're going to collect it, kind of put policies and laws in place where

00:40:59.785 --> 00:41:07.105
you're more responsible about this data so that it not only protects your company brand,

00:41:07.285 --> 00:41:12.325
but it also protects all your stakeholders, including the customers who have

00:41:12.325 --> 00:41:15.065
trusted you with this data. Yeah.

00:41:15.805 --> 00:41:22.045
So, again, the name of the books are digital assassin assassins,

00:41:22.245 --> 00:41:27.865
digital assassins to and protecting yourself, how data theft can impact you.

00:41:29.225 --> 00:41:34.225
Joy Reid when I was reading that I kept thinking about Joy Reid's famous quote

00:41:34.225 --> 00:41:38.825
scaring is sharing and scaring is caring even and,

00:41:39.965 --> 00:41:43.485
I was reading some of that stuff and I was like oh my god if they really wanted

00:41:43.485 --> 00:41:47.465
to come after me they could do this they could do that now I'm broke so I ain't

00:41:47.465 --> 00:41:52.305
got half the stuff you got but you know just the thought that they could,

00:41:53.005 --> 00:41:58.985
be that creative and go back and even car loans I was like Oh, my God.

00:41:59.145 --> 00:42:02.685
You know what I'm saying? So I want people to read this.

00:42:02.865 --> 00:42:04.925
I want people to read those books.

00:42:05.805 --> 00:42:13.645
Just, you know, whether they're in a situation where they want to be a whistleblower and be accountable.

00:42:15.581 --> 00:42:20.401
I hold people accountable, but just on every day, like you said,

00:42:20.521 --> 00:42:26.201
a situation you could be in a, you know, going through a divorce or, you know,

00:42:27.721 --> 00:42:31.881
somebody, you know, didn't like the fact that you beat them in fantasy football.

00:42:32.081 --> 00:42:33.921
I mean, whatever the case may be, right.

00:42:34.441 --> 00:42:39.801
People, people can have access to your information. And I think,

00:42:39.981 --> 00:42:42.281
and I think people kind of dismiss it.

00:42:42.421 --> 00:42:47.761
You know, all I remember is like, watching a lot of documentaries and all that.

00:42:47.961 --> 00:42:51.541
And, you know, they figured, well, the FBI was tapping their phone or whatever.

00:42:51.841 --> 00:42:55.361
And, you know, and people just kind of said, you know, like me is like,

00:42:55.441 --> 00:42:57.841
well, I ain't got, if they want to listen to what I got to say,

00:42:57.941 --> 00:42:59.601
it's, they're going to be bored. Right.

00:43:00.281 --> 00:43:03.861
But it's a lot more intense than that. And your books cover that.

00:43:04.061 --> 00:43:08.501
So, so tell people how, how they can get copies of the books,

00:43:08.501 --> 00:43:15.381
how they can reach out to you and, and, and, and get you to talk about these

00:43:15.381 --> 00:43:18.301
things or even, you know, just,

00:43:18.761 --> 00:43:24.541
you know, provide advice for folks to go to deal with protecting themselves?

00:43:25.841 --> 00:43:30.441
The books are available online, Barnes & Noble and Amazon.

00:43:30.841 --> 00:43:34.241
There's some other sites, but I'm going to say those are the two major.

00:43:34.581 --> 00:43:39.121
I have a website. it's danielspencil.org if

00:43:39.121 --> 00:43:43.061
you go to my website i'm on instagram facebook

00:43:43.061 --> 00:43:50.481
linkedin and i have all linked i say links to that social media too either way

00:43:50.481 --> 00:43:56.161
you know social media if you're on instagram send me a message you have questions

00:43:56.161 --> 00:44:02.521
if you go to my website my email address is on there too, feel free to reach out.

00:44:02.741 --> 00:44:07.921
For me, this is more, it's not like trying to make money or anything like that.

00:44:08.381 --> 00:44:10.721
It's very, like I said, education awareness.

00:44:12.755 --> 00:44:18.135
I went through this situation. I did not, I had no idea. And I've been in IT for almost 25 years.

00:44:18.655 --> 00:44:26.895
I didn't know how it could be misused. And I have a heart or a concern that

00:44:26.895 --> 00:44:32.815
I share that knowledge with as many people as possible so that we all can protect

00:44:32.815 --> 00:44:34.535
ourselves as best as possible.

00:44:35.235 --> 00:44:41.195
Well, again, like I said in the beginning, I think that what you did was important,

00:44:41.195 --> 00:44:45.175
even though it may have been small and the kind,

00:44:45.295 --> 00:44:52.015
it wasn't like the whistleblower for MCI WorldCom or the Eric Snowden and all

00:44:52.015 --> 00:44:53.775
that, but it was still important.

00:44:54.115 --> 00:44:58.415
And there are supposed to be laws, the whistleblower act and all that stuff

00:44:58.415 --> 00:45:05.415
is supposed to be laws to protect people who hold elected officials and government agencies accountable.

00:45:08.695 --> 00:45:16.555
And I'm empathetic to you that you went through a lot of this unnecessary stuff

00:45:16.555 --> 00:45:19.415
just because you were doing the right things.

00:45:19.415 --> 00:45:24.755
I want to stress that whistleblowing is the right thing to do.

00:45:24.775 --> 00:45:28.595
When you see something wrong, act on it.

00:45:28.995 --> 00:45:34.355
Now, if you are having problems, I suggest you talk to Daniel Spencer.

00:45:36.095 --> 00:45:42.255
And if you can't talk to it directly, get the books so you can understand,

00:45:42.255 --> 00:45:45.435
you know, how to navigate through all that.

00:45:45.775 --> 00:45:50.775
And, you know, I pray that nobody else goes through what you go through.

00:45:50.975 --> 00:45:57.395
I pray that you're able to convince people that make policy and make laws that

00:45:57.395 --> 00:46:04.735
they need to take this seriously and and to strengthen up what laws do exist. and,

00:46:05.544 --> 00:46:09.684
I think, again, it's vitally important that that people are held accountable.

00:46:09.944 --> 00:46:15.844
So I want to commend you for doing that as far as having the courage to to to

00:46:15.844 --> 00:46:16.984
hold somebody accountable,

00:46:16.984 --> 00:46:21.864
but also the added level of courage to navigate through all that you've been

00:46:21.864 --> 00:46:27.364
through and to go out and try to advocate for other people and to teach other

00:46:27.364 --> 00:46:30.364
people that they can work through it, too.

00:46:30.584 --> 00:46:34.984
And just make sure that you're protected as you go along them steps.

00:46:34.984 --> 00:46:37.824
So I just want to publicly commend you for that.

00:46:38.244 --> 00:46:42.904
And I want to thank you for coming on the podcast. I am really honored and greatly

00:46:42.904 --> 00:46:44.604
appreciated that you've taken this time.

00:46:45.444 --> 00:46:52.884
Thank you. And like I said, I appreciate and very grateful that you use your platform to share.

00:46:55.324 --> 00:46:58.704
I'll put it this way. There are a lot of people who aren't willing,

00:46:58.964 --> 00:47:04.124
but I understand. They have a concern about retaliation. So I understand.

00:47:04.984 --> 00:47:08.884
Well, you know, if you if you had done any background on me,

00:47:09.144 --> 00:47:12.764
the last thing I worry about is anybody retaliating on me.

00:47:13.144 --> 00:47:16.244
I ain't got nothing to take other than my life.

00:47:16.904 --> 00:47:21.724
And, you know, the trade off is I'll be in a better place if you do that.

00:47:22.704 --> 00:47:29.664
So I'm not worried about that. What I'm worried about is us living in a society where.

00:47:30.904 --> 00:47:35.584
You know, and you kind of mentioned the election. We're living in a society

00:47:35.584 --> 00:47:39.044
where it's like accountability is not fashionable anymore.

00:47:40.124 --> 00:47:44.384
And I think that is a grave mistake.

00:47:45.284 --> 00:47:56.644
And so for I wish that we had more people like you than what we are being offered as an American public.

00:47:56.864 --> 00:48:01.784
So, again, I want to commend you for that. And happy New Year to you.

00:48:01.784 --> 00:48:07.004
I hope 2025 is a lot more peaceful and a lot more prosperous to you.

00:48:08.304 --> 00:48:12.064
Thank you. All right, guys. And we're going to catch y'all on the other side.

00:48:12.720 --> 00:48:32.080
Music.

00:48:32.470 --> 00:48:38.390
Right. And we are back. So I want to thank Danielle Spencer for coming on and

00:48:38.390 --> 00:48:42.290
for being the brave person that she is.

00:48:43.210 --> 00:48:49.850
As you heard me mentioned several times in the interview, being a whistleblower

00:48:49.850 --> 00:48:52.870
is not something anybody seeks to be.

00:48:53.250 --> 00:49:00.070
But I'm glad there are people who are willing to call out corruption when they

00:49:00.070 --> 00:49:02.750
see it. I wish more people would do it.

00:49:03.190 --> 00:49:06.430
I wish less people would be corrupt. Right.

00:49:07.030 --> 00:49:13.810
But I'm really glad that she's doing it and that she is taking her experience, good and bad,

00:49:14.190 --> 00:49:25.070
and has decided to be an activist and an educator in teaching all of us how to protect ourselves.

00:49:25.950 --> 00:49:32.050
And I think that's vitally important as we get more technologically advanced, right?

00:49:32.830 --> 00:49:38.450
So I commend her for that. And again, I thank her for coming on.

00:49:39.210 --> 00:49:47.970
Now, at the beginning of the podcast, I said that this is not a good year already.

00:49:47.970 --> 00:49:53.150
I mean, we weren't even three hours or four hours, I should say,

00:49:53.270 --> 00:49:59.510
into the new year when 14 people were killed in New Orleans.

00:50:00.070 --> 00:50:08.170
And then the person who killed those 14 people basically died suicide by cop.

00:50:08.930 --> 00:50:13.250
Right. So 15 people at this point had died.

00:50:13.250 --> 00:50:20.570
And then later that morning in Las Vegas, somebody decides to take a cyber truck,

00:50:21.330 --> 00:50:25.250
drive it to a Trump hotel,

00:50:26.530 --> 00:50:30.030
shoot himself and set off an explosion in the truck.

00:50:31.534 --> 00:50:37.734
Fortunately, nobody outside of that perpetrator died, but that was 16 people.

00:50:38.974 --> 00:50:46.554
And then, you know, I missed out on something that happened in the Queens, right? A shooting.

00:50:47.174 --> 00:50:54.234
And then the first day of Congress, I guess this is the 119th session,

00:50:55.134 --> 00:50:57.754
Mike Johnson did not get enough votes to be speaker.

00:50:58.814 --> 00:51:03.294
So now, as I'm recording this, they're trying to figure out what to do.

00:51:03.914 --> 00:51:11.334
Are they going to keep Congress, the vote open, so two of the three people that

00:51:11.334 --> 00:51:15.574
didn't vote for Johnson will change their mind so he can go ahead and be Speaker

00:51:15.574 --> 00:51:18.574
and carry on with the business of government?

00:51:19.554 --> 00:51:23.314
Because they need to have that settled by January 6th so they can certify the

00:51:23.314 --> 00:51:26.974
election that Donald Trump won, right?

00:51:29.474 --> 00:51:36.394
So this is not a good start. I'm praying now for a strong finish for 2025,

00:51:36.394 --> 00:51:38.534
but right now this is not a good start.

00:51:40.994 --> 00:51:49.254
So as far as the tragedies go, I don't know what message this young man in Vegas was trying to send.

00:51:49.254 --> 00:51:55.714
I mean, it seems like he picked a Cybertruck, which is a Tesla product,

00:51:55.914 --> 00:52:01.994
which is owned by Elon Musk, and drove it to a Trump, the Trump International Hotel in Vegas.

00:52:02.774 --> 00:52:10.014
He was a military veteran. So as far as this recording, we don't know what his motive was.

00:52:11.634 --> 00:52:20.334
In New Orleans, you had New Year's going on. You had a college football playoff

00:52:20.334 --> 00:52:22.994
game ready to play that day.

00:52:23.714 --> 00:52:29.074
And then the Super Bowl is going to be next month in New Orleans.

00:52:31.274 --> 00:52:38.994
And while it is typically the MO of groups like ISIS to plan attacks like that,

00:52:39.254 --> 00:52:46.034
a lot of times, as in the case in New Orleans, you get radicalized people.

00:52:46.034 --> 00:52:50.154
It means people who fall into the

00:52:50.154 --> 00:52:56.754
rhetoric of a terrorist organization and decided to do a lone wolf act.

00:52:58.614 --> 00:53:04.014
You know, he lived in Houston, New Orleans. Is that not that far of a drive from Houston?

00:53:06.562 --> 00:53:11.842
Rented cars from Turo, so Turo's going to catch some flack for a little bit,

00:53:11.922 --> 00:53:18.982
and they're probably going to have to put some kind of screening process into their service.

00:53:19.122 --> 00:53:25.142
If you're not familiar with Turo, Turo is the Airbnb or the verbal of cars, right?

00:53:25.662 --> 00:53:31.742
Just like with those services, you can rent out my house or my condo for your vacation.

00:53:32.282 --> 00:53:34.182
With Turo, you can rent out my car.

00:53:35.602 --> 00:53:39.542
And they're probably going to have to try to figure out some way to deal with

00:53:39.542 --> 00:53:46.042
that just so they can deal with the blowback that they're receiving or about to receive. Right.

00:53:46.622 --> 00:53:52.942
But, you know, I don't know what motivated this dude to.

00:53:53.442 --> 00:53:58.242
And he was a military veteran. Well, he'd served, both of those guys served

00:53:58.242 --> 00:54:01.522
in combat in Afghanistan at some point.

00:54:02.682 --> 00:54:09.722
The gentleman that in New Orleans had served 20 years and was honorably discharged.

00:54:10.662 --> 00:54:16.402
So there was no indication during his military service that he was radicalized.

00:54:16.522 --> 00:54:18.522
It's something that happened after he's been out.

00:54:19.002 --> 00:54:22.322
And that was within the last four years.

00:54:23.162 --> 00:54:31.862
So I don't know, but all I can tell you is that we know as thinking people,

00:54:32.002 --> 00:54:35.742
as people that pay attention to world affairs, that the United States is not

00:54:35.742 --> 00:54:41.642
exactly a saint when it comes to international diplomacy and all this different stuff.

00:54:41.642 --> 00:54:46.822
But it doesn't ever warrant terrorism.

00:54:47.602 --> 00:54:54.442
But the only thing we can do is just try to live our lives, but always kind

00:54:54.442 --> 00:54:56.542
of keep the head on the swivel.

00:54:57.082 --> 00:55:01.102
And I know when people are having a good time, especially a holiday like New

00:55:01.102 --> 00:55:03.822
Year's, where everybody's drinking

00:55:03.822 --> 00:55:08.282
and partying, and it's very hard to be quote-unquote cautious. us.

00:55:08.982 --> 00:55:14.982
But in this day and age, we have to be. We have to pay attention to our surroundings.

00:55:17.082 --> 00:55:25.122
And we have to be cognizant of who we're around and what people are saying on

00:55:25.122 --> 00:55:28.422
social media and all that kind of stuff. We just have to.

00:55:28.922 --> 00:55:32.842
It sucks, but that's where we are.

00:55:33.902 --> 00:55:39.242
And, you know, It's just, I mean, that's just where we are.

00:55:39.802 --> 00:55:45.942
So to the families of the victims in New Orleans, my condolences to you all.

00:55:47.892 --> 00:55:52.332
Terrible way to start a year, to lose a loved one that way.

00:55:52.772 --> 00:55:58.452
And I can only pray and hope that you find strength, whether you're religious

00:55:58.452 --> 00:56:02.012
or not, to carry forward. It's not going to be easy.

00:56:03.692 --> 00:56:06.972
It's going to be a challenge for some time.

00:56:07.572 --> 00:56:11.972
But I just pray that you all find the strength and the courage.

00:56:12.672 --> 00:56:16.772
And if you are listening and you know any of those people, you know,

00:56:17.052 --> 00:56:23.932
be kind to them and help them if they need help. Help them if they don't ask for help.

00:56:24.352 --> 00:56:27.392
Just be a positive presence.

00:56:28.332 --> 00:56:31.712
Be a positive presence for the city of New Orleans.

00:56:32.592 --> 00:56:37.852
It's a city over the last 20 years that as seeing its share,

00:56:38.032 --> 00:56:42.232
but it is one of the most resilient cities in the United States,

00:56:42.392 --> 00:56:46.412
especially the people, but we continue to lift them up as well.

00:56:48.212 --> 00:56:53.072
So we got all this going on. We got all this chaos going on,

00:56:53.092 --> 00:56:57.872
which is why I always stress on this show for people to be focused.

00:56:58.852 --> 00:57:02.032
I need you to be your best selves, right?

00:57:02.792 --> 00:57:12.752
I need you all to continue to be strong and pay attention.

00:57:13.652 --> 00:57:17.632
We are not isolated at all in this world.

00:57:19.252 --> 00:57:23.072
The very thing that we hold in our possession every day, cell phone,

00:57:23.072 --> 00:57:25.492
connects us to the whole planet.

00:57:26.552 --> 00:57:30.692
But I just want you to focus, and that's why I wanted to take some time in the

00:57:30.692 --> 00:57:34.932
beginning of the show to highlight President Carter's life, because despite

00:57:34.932 --> 00:57:38.652
all the craziness that's going on, we can do good here.

00:57:39.912 --> 00:57:43.252
We may not live up to the building of the greatest nation in the world,

00:57:43.292 --> 00:57:46.052
but we can still be good people.

00:57:47.112 --> 00:57:53.792
And we still can do good things. And we still can change the world,

00:57:53.952 --> 00:58:01.052
even if it's just within our reach, whether it's our home, family, community,

00:58:01.912 --> 00:58:04.132
neighborhood, whatever.

00:58:05.472 --> 00:58:10.472
I think it was Hugo Humphrey that kind of said we can rebuild or,

00:58:10.472 --> 00:58:15.312
you know, shape the world, you know, one community at a time.

00:58:15.312 --> 00:58:21.412
I'm paraphrasing, but he said something along those lines, and Robert F. Kennedy Sr.

00:58:21.592 --> 00:58:25.032
Talked about the ripple effect that we have.

00:58:25.612 --> 00:58:32.792
We may think we're just a small stone skipping our pond, but the ripples that we create have impact.

00:58:32.792 --> 00:58:39.692
And so as we hear this news, as we watch these actions of our elected leaders,

00:58:39.692 --> 00:58:44.092
as we try to figure out what's going to happen next.

00:58:46.452 --> 00:58:49.792
We want us to be mindful about what we can do.

00:58:50.712 --> 00:58:58.832
And the other bad thing, well, it happened in 2024, but that ripple effect is

00:58:58.832 --> 00:59:02.912
going to carry over to 25 is the death of Robert Brooks.

00:59:02.912 --> 00:59:07.512
If you may have missed that, Robert Brooks, and we talked about it in the news

00:59:07.512 --> 00:59:12.232
segment, Robert Brooks was an inmate in New York State.

00:59:12.972 --> 00:59:17.932
For whatever reason, he was being interrogated by correction officers.

00:59:18.632 --> 00:59:21.732
They beat him, and he died the next day.

00:59:23.272 --> 00:59:28.412
And the governor fired those guards.

00:59:29.092 --> 00:59:34.212
But I'm kind of like other folks and like, you know, and the investigation is

00:59:34.212 --> 00:59:38.052
going on, so I expect Letitia James to put charges on these people.

00:59:38.792 --> 00:59:45.492
But of all the states where, you know, there's protection for law enforcement

00:59:45.492 --> 00:59:47.472
officers, New York kind of invented it.

00:59:49.372 --> 00:59:54.492
So regardless of how wrong these individuals are, it's going to be a challenge

00:59:54.492 --> 00:59:59.972
to convict them, as Eric Garner proved, right?

01:00:01.452 --> 01:00:09.952
So to the Brooks family, we lift y'all up, and we're hoping that justice emerges.

01:00:10.892 --> 01:00:17.592
But again, all of us listening, all of you all listening, all of us that are

01:00:17.592 --> 01:00:25.372
doing these podcasts and stuff, we just want everybody to just focus on doing good.

01:00:26.412 --> 01:00:32.112
Don't get caught up in all the hype, you know, and all the turmoil and all that stuff.

01:00:32.272 --> 01:00:38.632
We need you to be like fog lights and focus through that fog.

01:00:39.592 --> 01:00:44.712
Because the easy thing is for us to give up. The easy thing is to detach ourselves.

01:00:44.892 --> 01:00:50.312
The easy thing is to ignore what's happening until it happens to us.

01:00:51.032 --> 01:00:52.472
We don't have that luxury.

01:00:54.252 --> 01:00:58.832
And I'm going to stress it as long as I breathe. We don't really have the luxury

01:00:58.832 --> 01:01:02.952
to be divided in the black community. We really don't need to have the luxury

01:01:02.952 --> 01:01:06.272
to be divided as a nation. There are people that are hurting.

01:01:06.912 --> 01:01:11.032
There are people that are homeless. There are people who are hungry.

01:01:11.412 --> 01:01:14.032
There are people who are being miseducated.

01:01:14.492 --> 01:01:17.272
There are people who are being abused.

01:01:19.092 --> 01:01:25.452
And we as a nation have to figure out a way to address it.

01:01:27.250 --> 01:01:34.970
Can't do it, then it's up to us. We can support organizations that deal with specific issues.

01:01:35.370 --> 01:01:41.270
We can individually get engaged when we see something happening.

01:01:41.750 --> 01:01:49.370
But we've got to be focused and we've got to be engaged. We cannot be detached. We can't.

01:01:49.910 --> 01:01:55.190
Now, people who are detached more than likely are not listening to this podcast,

01:01:55.630 --> 01:02:01.770
but there are some of you who have been frustrated over this last,

01:02:01.950 --> 01:02:03.870
not just year, but decade.

01:02:04.990 --> 01:02:07.890
And you're at your wit's end.

01:02:08.570 --> 01:02:13.990
And I just have to remind you that we still have to keep our eyes on the prize.

01:02:14.470 --> 01:02:20.390
I'm not asking anybody to be a martyr. I'm not asking anybody to just jump to

01:02:20.390 --> 01:02:22.730
the front of the line and protest and all this stuff.

01:02:22.850 --> 01:02:26.530
I'm just asking people to be engaged and do the best you can.

01:02:27.210 --> 01:02:33.510
Do no harm. Do good. For all those young men and women who are being sworn in

01:02:33.510 --> 01:02:41.350
in their respective legislatures this week, do no harm, no matter what side of the aisle you are on.

01:02:41.970 --> 01:02:48.450
I know people have agendas, and they're trying to score points on politics and

01:02:48.450 --> 01:02:50.710
social media, do no harm.

01:02:51.030 --> 01:03:00.310
But make 2025 a year where we focus on helping people, on making sure that people get what they need,

01:03:01.110 --> 01:03:05.630
not necessarily what they want to hear, but that they get what they need,

01:03:05.790 --> 01:03:10.410
that they get the help that they desire.

01:03:10.410 --> 01:03:16.410
Because all of us at some point need help, some more than others.

01:03:16.950 --> 01:03:21.250
From a political standpoint, we can do a lot of good through organizing,

01:03:22.250 --> 01:03:25.790
through activism, and through government, right?

01:03:26.370 --> 01:03:30.570
But, you know, we have to be engaged to do that.

01:03:31.690 --> 01:03:35.530
So that's going to be my theme, I think, for the whole year,

01:03:36.310 --> 01:03:40.270
is that we just have to be engaged. We just have to focus.

01:03:40.830 --> 01:03:43.470
We have to be good.

01:03:44.710 --> 01:03:48.790
Despite what efforts anybody else tries to do to the contrary,

01:03:48.790 --> 01:03:51.590
we have to commit to be good.

01:03:52.130 --> 01:03:58.190
And I think if we as a collective body, as the majority, overwhelming majority

01:03:58.190 --> 01:04:02.930
of this nation decide that we're going to be good, then we're going to get through

01:04:02.930 --> 01:04:05.610
whatever adversity comes our way.

01:04:07.350 --> 01:04:14.330
That's it. I mean, Daniel Spencer is an example of that. Jimmy Carter is an example of that.

01:04:15.050 --> 01:04:18.350
And I pray that all of us can be examples of that.

01:04:19.190 --> 01:04:24.630
All right, guys, it can only get better from here. Thank you all for listening. Until next time.

01:04:25.680 --> 01:05:12.428
Music.